Jay Leno drives Scout Hybrid Harvester - Towing Capacity, Gas Fuel Tank Capacity, More Specs Revealed

[ohseedee]

I guess none of this should be a surprise. Nothing is free. You can't have a truck be both an EV and an ICE vehicle and expect it to be a good EV and a good ICE vehicle. For me, the harvester version is no longer appealing, and I have two reservations. While I know there are some niche situations where the harvester works, I'd argue almost all of those you'd be better off with either a full EV or a full ICE.

My perfect situation is a small generator with a small tank that can add range while moving, but not capable enough to drive fully on gas alone. Not a 50/50 EV/ICE, but a true EV with a booster. That way you'd not have to lose too much on the EV side in terms of range, cargo, and performance. When towing, road tripping, or going off grid you'd flip on "boost" mode, and you'd be able to extend your range maybe 50%. That would eliminate most range loss during towing and extend range in locations with poor EV infrastructure.

I think this is really only going to appeal to a small group now. Most of that group are going to be new to EVs I think, which is ok. My first EV was an i3 with a gas range extender, so I get it. Most existing EV owners and people who really need a truck for truck things I think will pass on the harvester in it's current form. While most reservations were harvester, that is probably not going to translate to what is purchased.

I'm going to keep my reservation as is and keep an eye on how things develop, but I assume it's way too late in the game for Scout to go in a drastically different direction. I'll also consider the EV only version, but I doubt it will have me move off Rivian.

 

[Dive Bar Casanova]

Wow, you must have to use washed out Forest Service roads to get to your local grocery stores & mall parking lots, and once you make it to the pavement, you need to beat Dodge Hellcats, etc. in a drag race to the best parking spaces.

IOW, all you really need is a Rav4 or maybe a Sienna?
Or for that matter, one of the Hyundai IONIQ models that are now rolling off the line in Georgia.
Because anybody who would buy a Scout partly because of 3.5 sec 0-60 doesn't really need this type of vehicle at all.

Astute, informed, intelligent remark!

We camp in some very rural, very difficult access areas, visit family that lives in very rural areas with extreme weather.
You must be very myopic to not consider that and jump to a conclusion like that about someone you absolutely know nothing about.

Also the very common, family friendly, run what-you-brung family off road grocery-hauler drag races you know nothing about. 0-60 3.5 seconds,, yeah, we'll be just fine with that.

Say it walkin' dude.

 

[Pogeegitz]

I'm going to keep my reservation as is and keep an eye on how things develop, but I assume it's way too late in the game for Scout to go in a drastically different direction. I'll also consider the EV only version, but I doubt it will have me move off Rivian.

Same here, although my decision when the time comes will be whether to keep the Terra and drop the Harvester, switch to a different EV manufacturer, or continue to hold out for fuel-cell vehicle maturity (which is the true way of the future, short of a Mr. Fusion)

 

[elvis buys]

If the Harvester's trailer tow capacity is really only 5,000 lbs., the weight of the engine sitting behind the rear axle might have something to do with it. The BEV version has the entire weight of the (larger, heavier) battery pack forward of the rear axle.

Referring to this (admittedly an early 'artist's conception' of the Harvester unit):

...makes me think even more that the 5,000 lb. tow limit is likely a result of having that much weight that far behind the rear axle. If we assume that the Harvester genset weighs, say, 300 lbs., that's almost like having 300 lbs. on the trailer hitch even before there's any trailer hooked up. The wheelbase isn't that long either, meaning the steering axle has less leverage on the trailer hitch (which may be the main reason the Terra has a lower tow rating than Traveler.)
If they'd sacrificed the 'frunk' the Harvester would have added weight to the steering axle instead, and resulted in a more well-balanced configuration (for towing).

 

[Hedrock]

Referring to this (admittedly an early 'artist's conception' of the Harvester unit):

...makes me think even more that the 5,000 lb. tow limit is likely a result of having that much weight that far behind the rear axle. If we assume that the Harvester genset weighs, say, 300 lbs., that's almost like having 300 lbs. on the trailer hitch even before there's any trailer hooked up. The wheelbase isn't that long either, meaning the steering axle has less leverage on the trailer hitch (which may be the main reason the Terra has a lower tow rating than Traveler.)
If they'd sacrificed the 'frunk' the Harvester would have added weight to the steering axle instead, and resulted in a more well-balanced configuration (for towing).

$5 says you’re right. Makes perfect sense…and once again, I really hope they armor the shit out of the underside of that area.

 

[Foobar]

Referring to this (admittedly an early 'artist's conception' of the Harvester unit):

...makes me think even more that the 5,000 lb. tow limit is likely a result of having that much weight that far behind the rear axle. If we assume that the Harvester genset weighs, say, 300 lbs., that's almost like having 300 lbs. on the trailer hitch even before there's any trailer hooked up. The wheelbase isn't that long either, meaning the steering axle has less leverage on the trailer hitch (which may be the main reason the Terra has a lower tow rating than Traveler.)
If they'd sacrificed the 'frunk' the Harvester would have added weight to the steering axle instead, and resulted in a more well-balanced configuration (for towing).

if you’re right, then I could see Scout upping the capacity back to 10K with a WDH. Rivian makes the same claims with their towing capacity - the full rating is only with a WDH and is halved otherwise.

 

[Noremac]

That 5,000lb towing capacity for the harvester hurts... I sure hope they figure out how to re-engineer their systems and get it up to 7000+.

 

[elvis buys]

if you’re right, then I could see Scout upping the capacity back to 10K with a WDH. Rivian makes the same claims with their towing capacity - the full rating is only with a WDH and is halved otherwise.

AFAIK, 5,000 lbs. is the limit without a WDH.
IOW, a WDH is required for more than 5,000 lbs "conventional" towing regardless of the total tow rating (even HD pickups that are rated to tow upwards of 18k lbs.)
So I wouldn't assume that having a WDH will increase the tow rating.

 

[Noplacelikeloam]

Weight of batteries is (more or less) should be offset by the elimination of the weight of engine, transmission and fuel. Of course towing will reduce battery range, just like towing reduces gas mileage. My hunch is that towing capacity is greatly reduced because you're trying to use an anemic gas engine w/minimalist transmission as a secondary drive train rather than a a pure EV that happens to carry an on-board generator/charger.

I'll add the caveat that I'm not an automotive engineer (aero) and have done minimal research here, but to me it seems like they're over-thinking and over-spec'ing the Harvester and creating a milquetoast option that no one will really be thrilled with.

The fact that the "pure EV Terra" specs line up with this table would support my hypothesis. I'd 100% take a 200 lbs playload hit to just have a 5-gallon tank and a generator built into the truck.

THIS!

As an R1T owner, I reserved both EREV and BEV but with the current approach I just cant imagine buying the harvester over what is out there. BEV all day for me. And lets not forget, all these are available today. 2-3 years from now the gap is going to be even wider.

I get there are a number of people that want to go roam around off road but that market wont allow you to scale or survive for very long. I fear they will either cancel it after a couple of years or rethink it.

 

[JesseS]

We're thinking the same. I wager the EV range will be more than we hear and that will tip it in the EV's favor.

800V architecture a big plus.

Plus I'm like the average guy my wife claims likes to go to the public chargers and plug their vehicle in.
EV Phenomena that astute Academics will be debating for millenniums.

With high insurance costs, high fuel costs, brutally high registrations we have to run fewer vehicles that have to do double, even triple duty.

Our pick up truck alone is $1400 a year registration / $1400 a year insurance, $300 to fill the tank, so less rolling stock in the garage and driveway is essential.

Plus charging it off the homes solar/Powerwall/& grid credit is a HUGE bonus.

WOW! my new Ford Ranger registration was $450, and USAA ins was $600, that must be some large truck!

 

[Dive Bar Casanova]

WOW! my new Ford Ranger registration was $450, and USAA ins was $600, that must be some large truck!

Diesel is just under $6 a gallon here too.
Elections have consequences.

 

[astricklin]

I suspect the technical issue that prevents the harvester from larger payloads is that they'd need to put a larger harvester engine in to do that. (I'm picturing a V8 sticking out the back.) I also suspect that the lower towing capacity is actually when using the hybrid mode, the all electric mode should be capable of the higher number.

I don't think they'll publish a separate rating based on drive mode.

From a consumer perspective that would be terribly confusing.
I hook up an 8k lbs trailer and now my 150 mile range dips to around 80 miles. I head out on my 75 mile trip but close to the end I'm running out of range and the range extended kicks in.....uh oh, now I'm 3k lbs over towing capacity. Better stop and wait for the range extender to charge up the battery and then keep going in EV mode? Or maybe I keep going and overheat the ice powerplant because I'm over working it. Maybe I keep driving for a while but the range extender can't keep up with the power demand and the vehicle runs out of juice and I'm now stranded on the side of the road, in a potentially dangerous situation.

No, instead they'll just give the EREV vehicle a single tow capacity rating.

 

[soedesh]

I don't think they'll publish a separate rating based on drive mode.

From a consumer perspective that would be terribly confusing.
I hook up an 8k lbs trailer and now my 150 mile range dips to around 80 miles. I head out on my 75 mile trip but close to the end I'm running out of range and the range extended kicks in.....uh oh, now I'm 3k lbs over towing capacity. Better stop and wait for the range extender to charge up the battery and then keep going in EV mode? Or maybe I keep going and overheat the ice powerplant because I'm over working it. Maybe I keep driving for a while but the range extender can't keep up with the power demand and the vehicle runs out of juice and I'm now stranded on the side of the road, in a potentially dangerous situation.

No, instead they'll just give the EREV vehicle a single tow capacity rating.

I agree. The rating will be the lesser. I was really thinking about the mechanical capacity.

 

[astricklin]

I agree. The rating will be the lesser. I was really thinking about the mechanical capacity.

The lower tow rating is probably mostly due to cooling needs. The ice powerplant is going to be tucked away underneath the vehicle where there's not a large open grill to have huge airflow over a radiator. Taking the Jeep Wrangler as an example, Jeep didn't change the motor/transmission/brakes or anything else mechanical on the drivetrain. They simply redesigned the grill for the 2024 model and this resulted in better cooling abilities and they increased the towing capacity from 3500 to 5000lbs.

However it could also be due to reduced payload capacity. Increasing the vehicle weight 100 lbs will lower the payload by the same amount and then lower the tow capacity by about 1000 lbs.

 

[Dive Bar Casanova]

Chevy Tahoe tows 7900 lbs - Harvester needs at least 7.000.